Hi,

I'm curious to learn more about the new EFIKA2.
For example, I would like to know how integrated the GFX system works.

- Does the GFX chip include display memory?

- Or will it use the main memory to store and read the pixel data from?

- If it uses the main memory will the EFIKA2 have an increased mem bandwidth then the EFIKA 1 ?

Sorry for all the question but I'm curious if applicatoin will run slower on the EFIKA 2 or faster ?

Many thanks in advance for any information

Cheers
Gunnar

As far as the specs go (all of this is on Google..), the PowerVR graphics unit simply is able to address up to 32MB of system memory for itself. Don't worry - you won't end up with an Efika2 with only 96MB of usable memory.. we learned our lesson.

The memory bandwidth should be the same as on the Efika - which in all technicality outperforms the Marvell Discovery II.

All of this is on Google. It would be quite a feat to produce a new chip on a 90nm process (from 130nm) with a DDR2 memory controller (from DDR) with a faster internal IP bus (200MHz vs. 133MHz) which runs applications slower.

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Matt Sealey

You are right the CPU of the EFIKA 1, has a memory bandwidth of around 250 MB/s which is very good for an embedded system and is in the range of an AmigaONE system (133MHz Bus), or a Pegasos G3.

Actually I can see quite some advantages of sharing the memory for GFX and CPU. Having the GFX in main memory allows application to read form GFX mem without penalty and it can reduce the amount of needed mem copy.

So if the increased bus speed from 133MHz to 200MHz will increase the memory througput accordingly I think the EFIKA 2 can not only consume less energy but also be faster than the Efika 1.

Cheers

Aren't PowerVR graphics closed source? NDA needed for 3D specs. Nokia N770 and N800 both have TI OMAP processors using PowerVR but there is no support for 3D because of the NDA problem. Freescale MX31 has the same issue.

We at Genesi committed to providing everything as open source as we can get it and where that is not possible, provide binary drivers for any distributions or operating systems that are interested.

While it would be nice to have a fully open source and fully documented driver for XGI and PowerVR chips (as an example), sometimes this just isn't possible.

However we have in the past embarked on proper patent licensing for MPEG, have learned a lot of lessons about support from XGI (Ian Romanick beat us to a cleaned up driver though, to be fair there is a lot of work even for XGI on this :) and other system solutions.

Remember part of Genesi's solution for Power Architecture is x86 emulation of graphics BIOS and a closed-source (and commercially licensed!) but open-specification firmware solution. We chose these because, while we can't just give everyone free access to things, they do need to Just Work (tm).

And if the "Efika 2" doesn't Just Work (tm), then it will be a failure..

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Matt Sealey

Hi Neko, does this mean that EFIKA2 will have 256MB RAM or more?

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Czech PowerPC User Group - http://powerpc.lukysoft.cz
MorphOS Software database - http://morphos.lukysoft.cz/en

We have all the source code for the drivers.

There will be more memory.

R&B :)

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http://bbrv.blogspot.com

:) Nice one!
And also please keep the evaluation board's feature of a plain DC input. That will reduce total cost quite something.
I guess the Efika2 will be a cool one, I am looking really forward to it.

"How the Efika 2 works ?"
Good question...
This is a nice project, but at least, does it already work today or is it another morphos-ware ?
Do we have to wait two more weeks or two more months ?
Is it going to be sold with VaporOS 2.1.5 ?

In the end, is the Efika 1 dead ?
... :-(

With ATI/AMD opening their specs, does this make you want to put an embedded ATI GPU on the Efika2 instead of the PowerVR in the 5121e? I haven't heard any hints of PowerVR being opened. ATI being open source shifts the calculus of what to build all around. You might even want to switch back to the MPC5200.

Closed source PowerVR is going to be a constant source of problems for alternative OS's.

Genesi claimed hare that they have the source code for every driver...

Considering how cheap a user-definable amount of RAM has become...

Doesn't mean that Open Source developers are going to get it. Genesi has signed the PowerVR NDA. This NDA stops the distribution of open source drivers for the hardware. You're going to be stuck with a binary blob.

Nokia N770 and N800 (Linux based OMAP) use the same PowerVR hardware and they have a blob for 2D and won't release a 3D blob because it is too much trouble.

Yeah you're going to be stuck with a binary blob, but we DO have the source code for these blobs. It is not like they shipped us a MontaVista-compatible driver which we need to run ancient versions of X.org on.

You are not going to be stuck with a display-less system if you decide not to choose whatever Linux distro or MorphOS bundle we provide. We WILL provide anything you need for it, within reason..
It's not going to be too much trouble for us to release the 3D blob. It's part of the support for the chip, so we are committed to providing it.

For reference, ATI do not make any suitable GPUs for this kind of device. The Mobility lines below X1xxx are practically discontinued.

There will be a version of the MPC5121 without graphics, and we will be looking at pairing up an XGI chip for want of any other suitable chipset available. This is exactly why we struck up a relationship with them - if you need an r200-class chip these days, you are pretty much looking at XGI or Matrox, and Matrox don't do 3D at those kinds of prices.

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Matt Sealey

No, Arno, NO.

To add a 512MB chunk of RAM to the board costs us about $12 where it costs you 20 Euro including shipping.

To add a slot to the Efika costs us -$10 +12c, but it costs you 20 Euro. We would still sell the board at $99 or $199 and you'd have to add your RAM cost to it.

Do you understand how economics works?

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Matt Sealey